Middle school tries new scheduling system

[longtimefirsttime]

http://www.indeonline.com/index.php?ID=18369&r=0&Category=1
"The central principle behind “block scheduling” is ridding students’ days of 45-minute classes. Instead of attending each core class each day of the week, the students would alternate schedules, attending two core classes for 90 minutes each on one day and then two additional core classes for 90 minutes the next. Those schedules will rotate back and forth all week long and are referred to as “A day” and “B day” schedules."

[austinsm11]

I have to say that I think this is a mistake. I think subjects especially like math need to be practiced everyday. Learning a new math concept on Thursday and then not being able to go over the homework until the following Monday will cause students to forget, imo. Most of our schools are on block scheduling in middle school. They usually have 80 minutes for math and 80 minutes for language arts everyday. Some schools then do an A/B schedule for science/social studies while other schools have each for only a semester. The last 80 minutes is divided into 2 forty minute periods for art, gym, band, etc.

Will they still be staying with the gender-based classes as well? Could make for an interesting 90 minutes in a boys classroom.

[Obie Wan]

I have to say that I think this is a mistake. I think subjects especially like math need to be practiced everyday.
Bingo. Repetition is the key to learning. Or maybe the Tigers should have long practices on Mondays and Wednesdays with off days on Tuesdays and Thursdays.

[longtimefirsttime]

"Principals at MMS commit to long haul"
http://indeonline.com/index.php?ID=18411&r=2&Category=1

[CarlE]

God, yet ANOTHER stupid idea in the dumbing down of American students. The Indians and Orientals must be laughing their a$$es off at this one. Whose freaking idea was this anyway?

"More time to be in-depth"....WHAT? Um more time that day without then addressing it for another five days? How much more indepth is THAT? STUPID.

[massillon catholic]

This is nuts! Is this the same principal who fired the very good middle school football coaches?

[austinsm11]

I can see time management being a problem as well. Kids putting off homework for a subject because they don't have that class the next day and then forgetting about it. I knew college students that couldn't handle this. How is the average middle school student?

Who will teach this extra 45 minute period of reading as well? Teachers won't be happy having to prepare for an extra prep everyday. Plus, on days that students have LA, they are looking at over 2 hours of reading/langauage arts. That is going to burn them out.

[Kamd50]

I totally agree with the notion of this age group of kids not being able to handle this type of schedule. I don't even think it would be suitable for high school age. Then when the kids forget their assignments, or where they left off at, or their supplies, or come in late because they forget which class they are supposed to be in on what day, the teachers are going to get angry and frustrated, the kids will get in trouble, and it will be just a big fiasco, I can guarantee it!

I am glad I have no kids there this year. I like the division of the boys and girls in 5th and 6th for some classes, but I agree.........STUPID!

And yes, MC, same guy.

[austinsm11]

I totally agree with the notion of this age group of kids not being able to handle this type of schedule. I don't even think it would be suitable for high school age. Then when the kids forget their assignments, or where they left off at, or their supplies, or come in late because they forget which class they are supposed to be in on what day, the teachers are going to get angry and frustrated, the kids will get in trouble, and it will be just a big fiasco, I can guarantee it!

I am glad I have no kids there this year. I like the division of the boys and girls in 5th and 6th for some classes, but I agree.........STUPID!

And yes, MC, same guy.

The teachers usually have a harder time remembering than most of the kids. The kids catch on really quick. One thing that I do like is that the A/B schedule days are set. Chaos happens after a snow day (or a couple) and no one knows if the A day was skipped or if the current day will be A day or what.

Most of the schools in North Carolina are on block scheduling for middle school and high school. LA and math meet everyday since they are the only subjects that count (that are tested). Science and social studies depend on the district.

I don't know for sure, but I think one main reason for the start of block scheduling was for science. Students could learn a new concept and discuss it and then go back to the lab and do an experiment.


I am still curious how the boys/girls classes went. I know many parents were happy about it, but I wonder if there was any increase in test scores and if so, how it compared to students in the regular classrooms. From what I have seen, it benefits the girls more than the boys. I also wonder how the teachers felt about it. The bad part is that when results are looked at after this year it will be harder to determine for this group if results were from the block scheduling or from the gender-based classrooms.

[massillon catholic]

Didn't the brilliant minds realize that the school would be bigger when they combined two schools??? This is one of the craziest things that I have ever heard!

[casey]

Fifteen years ago, I probably would have agreed that block scheduling would not be beneficial to students, however, teaching in a block format with "A" days and "B" days really does work. Having taught in Plain Local and using this system for twelve years, I saw more benefits than problems with it. The nice part was that when my Science or Social Studies' partner was teaching something that required research, we could combine our classes and have 180 minutes. This was great for research and the students then could see the relationship of my subject matter with regard to the other two disciplines.

If taught the way it was designed, the time passes quickly and much more material can be covered. One of the keys is to change activities every 20 to 25 minutes, but have a meaningful transition into the next area. Students seemed more interested and teachers adapted their methods to best fit their students needs. Although most people are apprehensive to accept change, I saw many students succeed using this schedule as it is flexible, yet educationally sound. I commend the staff of Massillon City Schools for undertaking this challenge.

[austinsm11]

Fifteen years ago, I probably would have agreed that block scheduling would not be beneficial to students, however, teaching in a block format with "A" days and "B" days really does work. Having taught in Plain Local and using this system for twelve years, I saw more benefits than problems with it. The nice part was that when my Science or Social Studies' partner was teaching something that required research, we could combine our classes and have 180 minutes. This was great for research and the students then could see the relationship of my subject matter with regard to the other two disciplines.

If taught the way it was designed, the time passes quickly and much more material can be covered. One of the keys is to change activities every 20 to 25 minutes, but have a meaningful transition into the next area. Students seemed more interested and teachers adapted their methods to best fit their students needs. Although most people are apprehensive to accept change, I saw many students succeed using this schedule as it is flexible, yet educationally sound. I commend the staff of Massillon City Schools for undertaking this challenge.


Are all classes on an A/B schedule? If so, how much more time is used at the start of the class to review/refresh students' minds from not having the class the day before? What effect did the switch to block scheduling have on test results? I also wonder what effect an A/B day schedule has on homework. How many kids will put off homework because the class doesn't meet the next day? Then the student either forgets how to do the homework or forgets to do it.

I believe that in teaching an 80-90 minute period every single day, an effective teacher can use several strategies and keep students engaged. I worry, however, about these classes only being every other day. If I have an A day class on Thursday, B day on Friday, Monday class is cancelled for snow, Tuesday is B day and then Wednesday I finally have my A day classes again....seems like alot of time to forget things.

[casey]

Austinsm11,

You asked some very inciteful questions. GlenOak had 90 minute classes for all subjects, but I agree that there are some subjects that could be taught in less time. We also did not include a "C" day, but modified the other days to accomodate for assemblies, etc. The district also accomodated snow days by going on strictly an A/B schedule rather than doing an A/A or B/B day consecutively--Example: snow days often occurred on B days, we would go back to that day upon our return from the weather-related closures. This does not mean that Massillon's system will not work, it is just different than the way we did it.

As far as the review at the beginning, most of us used at least 10 minutes to provide set induction which provided review and a "tie in" to the lesson of the day. Since I taught English, I would allow them to start their homework during the last 10 minutes of class and would make sure that they were on task.

Test scores drastically improved and the high school has been rated "excellent" by The State of Ohio for at least the last 6 years. The district has been rated at this level for at least the last two or three years.
Realizing that we went from "Continuously Improving" to "Excellent" might be indicative of the progress that we made from using this format. Most students' work improved and more people did do their homework

I totally agree that an excellent teacher can engage and inspire students to learn, however, I think that this system can save many. Perhaps it would not work in all systems, but it worked for us. After 30 years in education, I feel that this method was more effective than the "traditional" classroom style, but I realize that it might not work everywhere. Although I retired two years ago, I still follow the district's progress on The Ohio Department of Education's website.

[Kamd50]

Well, I will admit that hearing from someone who has had actual experience and success with this method is at least enough to make me be more open-minded about the issue. It certainly would be a pleasant surprise if Massillon did indeed enjoy the same type of benefits in overall production from the students as casey has stated as her personal experience.

I guess time will tell. Here's hoping that the skepticism of some of us turns out to be unfounded:drinkem:

[austinsm11]

My problem is more with the A/B scheduling. Especially with math, where everything builds off previous lessons and concepts. Missing a day in an A/B schedule is much harder to make up than in a regular schedule. A student who is struggling a bit with a math problem on Thursday can come back on Friday and hopefully see how the homework problems are worked out and "get it" with a little additional help from the teacher. Put the student in the same scenario where he/she doesn't come back to math class until Monday and the student will probably need much more help. Questions the student may have had about particular problems may be forgotten more easily. I remember as a child saving my homework over the weekend for Sunday night and struggling with trying to remember how to do the work, but maybe that was just me.

If taught the way it was designed, the time passes quickly and much more material can be covered.
How so? 90 days x 90 minutes = 8100 instructional minutes
180 days x 45 minutes = 8100 instructional minutes
You also allow 10 minutes of HW in class. My experience is that teachers in block scheduling allow students to start homework (less instructional time) more so than teachers in a regular schedule.


Perhaps a better schedule would be more of a compromise...say 60 minutes for LA, math, ss, and science every single day. Figure in a 20-25 minutes for lunch. Then 45 minute classes for 2 or 3 of the following computers, band, choir, gym, art, etc. depending on the length of the school day.

[Kamd50]

During last school year, both my 12 grader and 8th grader had plenty, if not all, teachers who allowed HW time at the end of their classes just about every day, in a regular schedule.

[casey]

Austinsm,

Believe me, I am not saying that "block scheduling" is meant for every school, I am just saying that it worked in Plain Local. Also, I agree with your statement that some subjects are better constantly reinforced as "Repetition is the Mother of Studies."

As I am reflecting on my previous posts, I forgot to add that the computer class was built into our curriculums (for credit) as they had to complete projects in our disciplines that implemented computer knowledge/skills (Word Processing, Powerpoint, Data-based projects, etc.).

As for some "Performing Arts' classes," they benefitted from the 90 minute classes, also, as they could get more done in that length of time, especially when they needed to "set up" prior to their presentations.

You stated that "block schedulers" tended to decrease their instructional time via giving time for homework. If the homework is a meaningful extension of the instructional process and not given to "fill up time," it gives the students and their instructor time to see if there is an understanding (cognitive link) between what was presented and comprehension. It also offers time that the instructor can devote to individualized instruction of their students and best meet their needs.

Many of us are reluctant to change our styles and methods, but the 21st Century is here. Believe me, I was fearful, but it did prove to be successful. Please note, that I am not suggesting that this method is for every district, but be open-minded and try it, adjust it or modify it to best fit the needs of the students who attend Massillon City Schools!!! I am very proud that I graduated from that school district and only want the best for it.

[austinsm11]

Kamd, if your kids are getting a good bit of time in most classes to start homework, especially on a traditional schedule, this maybe one of the reasons for the troubles at the schools. I don't know about the middle school, but we had studyhall at the high school(at least a 20-25 minute one opposite lunch) to get some if not all of our homework done while not wasting instructional time in class on homework.

Casey, you mentioned having more time with an A/B block schedule to cover more material. I showed that the instructional minutes would be the same. If you are spending 10 minutes for this 1 on 1 help (I'm not saying this is wrong) then that is also 10 minutes less everyday that new material is not covered. This would equal about 15 hours over the course of a year. IMO, there should be dependent practice, independent practice (but interactive with the teacher if needed), and then homework. If a 6th grade student should have 60 minutes of actual homework and half of it is getting done in class, they are not getting enough independent practice on their own at home from the homework.

Massillon only met 2 out of 9 indicators. Math in all grades is not even close. Since students are tested only in math and reading, how will changing these classes to an A/B schedule help improve test results? Perhaps math and reading should be everyday classes of longer time periods. Who will teach the extra 45 minute reading period each day? I imagine all teachers will share in this responsibility. I hope the math, science, la, etc. teachers are given some extra training on effective strategies for this class and not just thrown in there.

What I worry about with what I hear at Massillon is that something is wrong so they go out to look for the flavor of the week as far as educational ideas. It seems as though little research is done as far as the new practices. They already tried to implement the gender-based classes. Not much as been said from the superintendent other than basically if it didn't seem to do any harm, they would continue it. The biggest challenge is with the boy classes, and I am curious how much/ what training was given to the educators of these classes. One teacher even indicated that she seemed to notice progress out of the girl classrooms but the boy classrooms were much more challenging. Many of these classes fail because educators are not given the proper training. Why not wait another year or two and see how the gender-based classes go? If they prove to improve student achievement, then the whole school could move to this. Instead they are moving to block scheduling and keeping the gender-based classes, which could make it harder to determine which has more of a positive effect on test scores.

I am very familiar with block scheduling Most of the high schools in NC are on 4x4 block schedules, which won't work at the middle school levels. Most middle schools have blocks of 60-90 minutes, but LA and math meet everyday, which makes sense since they are the tested subjects. I am all for block scheduling. I am just skeptical how an A/B schedule for math and LA will bring up math and LA test scores. There are very, very few middle schools that do block scheduling this way, so there can't be much research and statistics on this.

[massillon catholic]

Seems to me these things should have been ironed-out BEFORE they put kids in the middle school. Now, we are using several years of students as "guinea pigs".

[Kamd50]

Just an observation, A11. You just posted this statement:
"If a 6th grade student should have 60 minutes of actual homework and half of it is getting done in class, they are not getting enough independent practice on their own at home from the homework."

And then earlier, you posted this statement:
"we had studyhall at the high school(at least a 20-25 minute one opposite lunch) to get some if not all of our homework done while not wasting instructional time in class on homework. "

Are you saying then that a 6th grader should have 60 minutes of homework each night but 20 minutes is plenty of time for a highschooler to have? It seems to me it should be just the opposite. While I recognize the need for some, I personally have never been in favor of bombarding a kid with homework either.

About the study halls. It is my understanding that they eliminated them last year in 8th gr. for sure, and extended lunch. Why? I have only heard speculation. In highschool, a LOT of kids who are involved in other things besides their required classes, kids who try to squeeze in extra classes, and kids who work as assistants for different teachers or the offices or advisory board or annual board, don't have any study halls.

[austinsm11]

Just an observation, A11. You just posted this statement:
"If a 6th grade student should have 60 minutes of actual homework and half of it is getting done in class, they are not getting enough independent practice on their own at home from the homework."

And then earlier, you posted this statement:
"we had studyhall at the high school(at least a 20-25 minute one opposite lunch) to get some if not all of our homework done while not wasting instructional time in class on homework. "

Are you saying then that a 6th grader should have 60 minutes of homework each night but 20 minutes is plenty of time for a highschooler to have? It seems to me it should be just the opposite. While I recognize the need for some, I personally have never been in favor of bombarding a kid with homework either.

About the study halls. It is my understanding that they eliminated them last year in 8th gr. for sure, and extended lunch. Why? I have only heard speculation. In highschool, a LOT of kids who are involved in other things besides their required classes, kids who try to squeeze in extra classes, and kids who work as assistants for different teachers or the offices or advisory board or annual board, don't have any study halls.

Let me clarify. I meant that most every student has a 20-25 minute studyhall because I know that there are some students (as you mentioned) who take so many electives that they didn't have a regular 45 minute period studyhall. This should provide some time to get some homework done. I think that I usually had 20-25 of Precalc or calc alone. I believe that I always had at least one 45 minute studyhall but some semesters I had two. I always did homework in homeroom as well and that limited me to little if any homework at home during the 2 studyhall(plus lunch studyhall) semesters. From what I have read students should have an average of about 10 minutes per grade level. Some nights there will be more and some less. I didn't mean to imply that a 6th grader should have more homework than a 12th grader.

I don't know why they would extend lunch. Most schools give too little time to eat because they want students to just eat and move on before getting into any trouble.

[Kamd50]

Wow, that is interesting. None of my kids have ever had 45 min. study halls because of their schedules.I never wanted them to have that much time to goof off in school, lol! Things have changed my friend! They don't even have homeroom on an everyday basis at the highschool anymore. I will have to check, but I think that they have it once a week.

[austinsm11]

Times have changed. Most kids when I was in school had at least one 45 minute period studyhall. It was really beneficial when you have sports after school. I did know one student however, who scheduled so many classes his junior year that he didn't even have a lunch. He cleared it with guidance and came down and ate lunch the last 5 min. of one class and first 5 min. of another.
Many schools either have moved the homeroom to later in the day or got rid of it for most days. We had to watch channel one and it was moved to the start of 2nd period because kids would not show up on time for school because the first 15 minutes were "just" channel one. Now that you mention homeroom, I guess we didn't have it everyday either. I did some type of homework or reading for a class during channel one.

[austinsm11]

http://www.massillon.sparcc.org/index.php?mact=News,cntnt01,detail,0&cntnt01articleid=160&cntnt01origid=15&cntnt01returnid=15

The school is ramping up its accelerated curriculum even more. Beginning in the fall, seventh grade students can take freshman-level algebra and eighth graders will be offered the geometry course traditionally taken by sophomores.


Very impressive, imo. Sounds like a great way to push the higher students even more.