Ridgley will look to get Massillon in the Federal League

[austinsm11]

http://www.indeonline.com/index.php?Category=2

Once Ridgley gets past the financial challenges, he knows there is an even bigger challenge facing him down the road in the quest to gain Massillon admission into the Federal League. The league issue has been one which has swirled around the program for at least six years, and one which seems to have no immediate resolution.

But Ridgley makes no bones about his feelings on whether the Tigers should be in a league or remain an independent.

“I think we have to get in a league,” Ridgley said.

[orangeblood]

:sad2: :sad2:

[obie7661]

:sad2:

You're not alone orangeblood.

Here's Mona Lisa's reaction when she heard Ridgely was contemplating the Fed.

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/PBTS/monalisa3.gif

[chap]

:down: :puke:

[massillon catholic]

Wonder if this position was a pre-requisite for the job?

[DAWGH8R]

Wonder if this position was a pre-requisite for the job?

Wouldn't be surprised. Why else would he be in this position, unless he sold his soul ??
http://www.madjacksports.com/forum/images/smilies/mj13.gif

[massillon catholic]

http://www.indeonline.com/index.php?Category=2



If we have to get in a league, why does it have to be the Fed? Aren't there any other options?

[Fats]

I have spoken against this move many times on this forum. At times posters have said lets leave it alone, the subject should be put aside.
Now you See why we must rant and stand up against this FEd mindset.
Ridgley spoke of higher attendance if we joined the Fed. - NO PROOF has ever been given to theory(look at the n.c. playoff game). He spoke of schedule problems Massillon has never had a unfilled schedule. Ridgley said the competition would be comparable(what is our record against the Fed exclude Mck.), that I do not believe.
Ridgley said that we have early season to schedule the Top teams in the state.
Ask Mckinley why they dropped the Big Boys from their schedule. Ask him if it is smart to play St. Iggy or Warren on opening day.
SAY NO to the FED. If we stay quiet on this issue then the day will come that we will be the Massillon Federal Tigers.

[austinsm11]

If we have to get in a league, why does it have to be the Fed? Aren't there any other options?

But Ridgley makes no bones about his feelings on whether the Tigers should be in a league or remain an independent.

“I think we have to get in a league,” Ridgley said.

He says that we have to get into A league, but then he only talks about the Fed. I don't know what other league options there would be, especially if he is looking for a league for all of Massillon sports and not just football.

[Banks]

Not sure why everyone is so surprised at this.

[Benchboss1]

Wonder if this position was a pre-requisite for the job?


It absolutely WAS a pre-requisite to land that job!!

As much as this hurts me to type, we WILL be in the Federal League in the not to distant future!:puke:

[CATS44]

Of course it was a prerequisite.

Its the right move, the intelligent move, the fiscally responsible move, the move which is the most student-parent-fan friendly.

Why would intelligence and wisdom NOT be a prerequisite?

[Marie]

It's time for Cats44 to again tell us how wonderful the fed is.

[orangeblood]

It's time for Cats44 to again tell us how wonderful the fed is.:puke: :puke:

[longtimefirsttime]

This has been discussed as long as this forum has been around. We've heard every conceivable reason both for and against. And it's been apparent for years that the decision-makers in the district are in favor of joining the Fed. There is one thing and only one thing that will keep the Tigers out, a continued vote of opposition by the Fed schools. (I hope they continue to do so.)

[massillon catholic]

Of course it was a prerequisite.

Its the right move, the intelligent move, the fiscally responsible move, the move which is the most student-parent-fan friendly.

Why would intelligence and wisdom NOT be a prerequisite?



:bs:

[MassFan3]

Of course it was a prerequisite.

Its the right move, the intelligent move, the fiscally responsible move, the move which is the most student-parent-fan friendly.

Why would intelligence and wisdom NOT be a prerequisite?

Cats, I believe it's been awhile since I've personally seen you post. Welcome back. I couldn't agree with you more. Joining the Fed makes so much sense, I can't even comprehend how others view this as a downfall? Especially with our school system shrinking....

Really people? You think joining the Fed is bad? C'moooon....

[MassFan3]

Also....of course the other Fed teams will not want us in - with us and McKinley, nobody else would win the league in football! lol

[tiger#22]

Of course it was a prerequisite.

Its the right move, the intelligent move, the fiscally responsible move, the move which is the most student-parent-fan friendly.

Why would intelligence and wisdom NOT be a prerequisite?

:zzz: Must have copied and pasted this from one of the thousand times he posted this before.....:puke:

[longtimefirsttime]

This is listed on the Ohio High School Football Coaches Association website.

"Jackson High School in Stark County has open dates week #1 and week #2 in 2008 – 2009.We are seeking home and home opponents. Interested coaches should call Thom McDaniels at 330 834-4538 (school)"

Do you think there's any chance of a Jackson/Massillon matchup? Would you want to see it?

[orangeblood]

This is listed on the Ohio High School Football Coaches Association website.

"Jackson High School in Stark County has open dates week #1 and week #2 in 2008 – 2009.We are seeking home and home opponents. Interested coaches should call Thom McDaniels at 330 834-4538 (school)"

Do you think there's any chance of a Jackson/Massillon matchup? Would you want to see it?There is no chance because THEY will not do it, and that comes from the TOP of their system. "Book it Dano.":rockin:

[Red50Go]

Why show your hand like that? We have been grovelling for 4 years now. Keep your mouth shut, do your thing, and let them come to us because that is the ONLY way we will ever get in. This is like asking that girl out after she says no. All we are doing is providing an annual opportunity for them to tell us why they dont want us and frankly it is beneath us. I was in favor of joining a couple years ago but the pride thing kicks in eventually.

Like I said, if we get in fine, if we dont fine, but SHUT UP! Now we get to hear about our drunk fans, poor students, and cheating boosters for the next 2 months, when we all know the REAL reason. :wall:

[monte81]

There is no chance because THEY will not do it, and that comes from the TOP of their system. "Book it Dano.":rockin:

We agree on alot of things from reading some of your posts but Coach McD is not afraid to schedule us and would fight for a game with the tigers. If a game is set up it would be the stkes needed to begin our FED process. McD wants us in and would help build his program. However I do not wish for the tigers to be in the FED and love the independent schedule and competition. Saying that I think the FED might re-think us being in when Fitch and Boardman bounce out in a year or so. I just feel year in and year out that it would be loopsided contests and the tigers and bulldogs owning most football hardware! In other sports it may benefit the program because he would have to step up our game in baseball, track, wrestling, etc,... to be champions. Academically I do not see any special benefits in joining but I could be wrong.

[giant lugey]

It won't even be an issue until Fitch and Boardman drop out, which is likely to happen in the next few years.

[orangeblood]

We agree on alot of things from reading some of your posts but Coach McD is not afraid to schedule us and would fight for a game with the tigers. If a game is set up it would be the stkes needed to begin our FED process. McD wants us in and would help build his program. However I do not wish for the tigers to be in the FED and love the independent schedule and competition. Saying that I think the FED might re-think us being in when Fitch and Boardman bounce out in a year or so. I just feel year in and year out that it would be loopsided contests and the tigers and bulldogs owning most football hardware! In other sports it may benefit the program because he would have to step up our game in baseball, track, wrestling, etc,... to be champions. Academically I do not see any special benefits in joining but I could be wrong.Monte, I did not mean Coach McD, I meant the superintendent out there, and their board of ed. I have talked to people who live out there, and this is what they tell me.

[orangeblood]

Why show your hand like that? We have been grovelling for 4 years now. Keep your mouth shut, do your thing, and let them come to us because that is the ONLY way we will ever get in. This is like asking that girl out after she says no. All we are doing is providing an annual opportunity for them to tell us why they dont want us and frankly it is beneath us. I was in favor of joining a couple years ago but the pride thing kicks in eventually.

Like I said, if we get in fine, if we dont fine, but SHUT UP! Now we get to hear about our drunk fans, poor students, and cheating boosters for the next 2 months, when we all know the REAL reason. :wall:This is a good, post, the only thing I disagree with is I DO NOT WANT IN, ESPECIALLY IN FOOTBALL.

[Fats]

Of course it was a prerequisite.

Its the right move, the intelligent move, the fiscally responsible move, the move which is the most student-parent-fan friendly.

Why would intelligence and wisdom NOT be a prerequisite?

cats44, Tell me how less home games(less ticket revenue, no concession money) would help this program. As for attendance, the N. Canton playoff game had very little N. C. Fans in attendance and that was a playoff game. When Massillon beats the FEds on a regular basis what does that do to attendance. Standing in line to get tickets to a away FED game. What help will that do for our program.
How many years have we had an open schedule?
I do not see us scheduling a powerhouse in the first 3 weeks of the season.
So how does Less Home Games, Massillon fans being shut out of local games, Tigers no longer playing the powerhouses, Make us a better program.

I would agree that our minor sports would benefit from a league schedule, but our major sports would not.

[monte81]

Monte, I did not mean Coach McD, I meant the superintendent out there, and their board of ed. I have talked to people who live out there, and this is what they tell me.

orangeblood,
I understand that but I think the McD will push for a game and would TRY to sway Jackson to vote us in the league. NOONE wants to schedule Iggy, Warren, and Mentor the 1st 3 games of the season. If we did get in and I am hoping not right now we would have some watered down games in weeks 1-3 and 4-9 wouldn't be all that interesting once we start hammering teams by 20-30 points every week IMO. Some years we would have problems becuase teams have off years but we would control football along with the Pups 8 out of ten years.

[obie7661]

No sense everyone gettin' their knickers in a twist, because The Tigers will never be voted into the FED. IMO.

The FED has an honest-to-goodness, unadulterated disdain for Massillon.

No FED ... I'm fine with that.

[Tiger54]

This has been discussed as long as this forum has been around. We've heard every conceivable reason both for and against. And it's been apparent for years that the decision-makers in the district are in favor of joining the Fed. There is one thing and only one thing that will keep the Tigers out, a continued vote of opposition by the Fed schools. (I hope they continue to do so.)

Yes, I hope that they keep telling us that they don't want us because we sure don't want them. And it seems like our "chiefs" keep shoving it at us. After all, we are only the ones who buy the season tickets every year! Boy, I can get REAL excited about the thought of playing Perry, Jackson, NC, every year! NOT!!!! Why can't we get it thru our chiefs' heads?! Sure, it will make the AD's job easier for scheduling purposes.

[MTown]

I think the fact that the folks on both sides need to remember is that it's not up to us to join the Fed. We can apply all we want, but they have to say YES. I know the landscape is changing a little bit in the Fed, but there are still a couple of schools who will NEVER, EVER, EVER vote us in.

Look at the votes...

YES
McKinley
Perry
Glenoak

NO
Hoover
Jackson (McD won't be there long enough to change the mindset)
Lake

That's a deadlock and do any of you really think the 3 no votes are ever going to change?

[tiger embalmer]

Coach Stacy has said a number of times he would like to see Massillon in the Federal League. So I'm sure it will happen it’s just a matter of time. I guess there have been too many problems with scheduling opponents and being in a league would put a stop to it. You have to do what is best for the players of all the sports not what can bring in the most money.

[Red50Go]

No sense everyone gettin' their knickers in a twist, because The Tigers will never be voted into the FED. IMO.

The FED has an honest-to-goodness, unadulterated disdain for Massillon.

No FED ... I'm fine with that.


Well kicking their sorry butts 9 x out of 10 doesn't help any. Otherwise they would LOVE to play us, disdain or not.

[massillon catholic]

Will Lake be leaving the Fed anytime soon?

[MassFan3]

I really feel games vs. Perry and ESPECIALLY Jackson would definitely bring in money! I have many friends who would kill to see Massillon Washington vs. Massillon Jackson. It's like Good vs. Evil.

[RRanger]

You're not alone orangeblood.

Here's Mona Lisa's reaction when she heard Ridgely was contemplating the Fed.

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/PBTS/monalisa3.gif

sorry, but we will be in the fed sonner then you think,football is football if your in the fed's or not, i would like to win the federal trophy,then the state

[massillon catholic]

Coach Stacy has said a number of times he would like to see Massillon in the Federal League. So I'm sure it will happen it’s just a matter of time. I guess there have been too many problems with scheduling opponents and being in a league would put a stop to it. You have to do what is best for the players of all the sports not what can bring in the most money.


Its not up to Coach Stacy whether we get into the Fed or not, its up to the Fed member schools. McDaniels will find out in Jackson soon, that he is not running the program and will probably only last a year or two. The Jackson Admin will never let Massillon in. I will have an update on that soon, as I have a call into a friend who is on the Jackson School Bd. If Lake stays in, they won't vote in favor, neither will Hoover. It ain't happening, IMO.

[giant lugey]

I don't think "the chiefs" are putting the wishes of the football season ticket holders at the top of their list, as well they shouldn't. I think they are putting the best interests of ALL the athletes in ALL the sports at the top of their list.
I think even most of the die-hard Anti Fed folks have agreed the Fed would be good for all the other sports.
I don't know what the right decision is, but I do hope they do put the interests of ALL the kids over my interests as a season ticket holder.
If some of the teams or kids in the minor sports could win a league championship, or be voted a league MVP, then I certainly can miss an away game now and then.

[MassFan3]

Its not up to Coach Stacy whether we get into the Fed or not, its up to the Fed member schools. McDaniels will find out in Jackson soon, that he is not running the program and will probably only last a year or two. The Jackson Admin will never let Massillon in. I will have an update on that soon, as I have a call into a friend who is on the Jackson School Bd. If Lake stays in, they won't vote in favor, neither will Hoover. It ain't happening, IMO.


Yeah, just like he found out he wasn't running McKinley, too.:ohplease: Look what happened there. The only way he leaves Jackson after a year or two is by his own accord.

[DAWGH8R]

Has McKinley ever bragged about winning a FED title ??? You can wipe your butt with those. I'd rather play an Iggy, Ed's, Harding, Moeller, Elder, etc vs those FED schools.

[massillon catholic]

Yeah, just like he found out he wasn't running McKinley, too.:ohplease: The only way he leaves Jackson after a year or two is by his own accord.

It will be by his own accord because he wont put up with the BS!

[MassFan3]

Has McKinley ever bragged about winning a FED title ??? You can wipe your butt with those. I'd rather play an Iggy, Ed's, Harding, Moeller, Elder, etc vs those FED schools.

True, but YOU'RE not going to play them physically, like our kids will. It's not smart.

[MassFan3]

People, not every league is going to have team after team full of state powers. If the Fed has Massillon, McK, Perry, Jackson, etc. that comes pretty close. People on here want to continue to play a suicidal independent schedule on the basis that those teams would make us better - the Fed is no slouch. It's not like we're playing Sandy Valley, Tuslaw, etc.

[DAWGH8R]

Massillon and McKinley in the fed would make it about the 4th toughest league in the state. Who cares. The fed isn't as tough as they would like you to think it is.

They have a good gig in the FED. Perry recruits a wrestling team, Hoover recruits a girls softball team, and no one complains. McKinley gets their " homegrown move-ins ", and everythings OK.

If we join and get a TRANSFER, the roof would come down !

What's good for the goose, doesn't apply to us !!

[massillon catholic]

They have a good gig in the FED. Perry recruits a wrestling team, Hoover recruits a girls softball team, and no one complains. McKinley gets their " homegrown move-ins ", and everythings OK.

If we join and get a TRANSFER, the roof would come down !

What's good for the goose, doesn't apply to us !!

Exactly Right! If we were in the Fed and Torrence transferred to Massillon. The next meeting would be to turn us into to the OHSAA. The next meeting would be to vote us out!

[monte81]

It will be by his own accord because he wont put up with the BS!

Jackson has the best coach they could of gotten in the off season and they know it is not for keeps but he will make changes or waves that the Admin do not approve--if he gets his way we will be playing Jackson within 2/3 years!
McD took that job waiting on Coach Stacy to jump ship for the NCAA in a few years and then he will be our next HC! Bank on that--he was the 1st choice in 2005 before WGH refused to let him out of his contract. Funny he was out after that move backfired on him. McD is not a fancy playcaller but he is a solid coach that wins! JMO.

However if a vote is taken for us to join the FED McD will voting YES in favor of the tigers! I am still against it but my vote does not count for nothing in this game.

[massillon catholic]

However if a vote is taken for us to join the FED McD will voting YES in favor of the tigers! I am still against it but my vote does not count for nothing in this game.


McDaniels doesn't have a vote to be voting YES!

[monte81]

McDaniels doesn't have a vote to be voting YES!

He will persaude the Jackson Admin to vote yes because he wants us in as well!

[section3]

didn't we just hire lakes head coaches son??

[massillon catholic]

He will persaude the Jackson Admin to vote yes because he wants us in as well!

That ain't happening at Jackson.

[monte81]

That ain't happening at Jackson.

If it comes down to voting after Fitch and Boardman leave we get Jackson's vote because of McD. BET????

[massillon catholic]

If it comes down to voting after Fitch and Boardman leave we get Jackson's vote because of McD. BET????

McDaniels will be at Massillon before Fitch and Boardman leave.

[DragonTigerNemesis]

If it comes down to voting after Fitch and Boardman leave we get Jackson's vote because of McD. BET????


Mr. Monte - You would LOSE that bet.

McDaniels is not going to change the minds of the Jackson "powers that be".

For fifty or more years, they have absolutely HATED the fact that their children live so close to Massillon and GOD FORBID might interact with Massillon kids.

I don't see this attitude changing for the foreseeable future.

Does the Fed vote have to be unanimous? If it does, this whole discussion is moot because the Jackson people will not vote for anything that might cause their precious innocent little angels to have to venture into Massillon to a football game.

And---I'm sorry Monte, but the whole Jesse Davis thing is not going to help.


:kungfu:

[massillon catholic]

Mr. Monte - You would LOSE that bet.

McDaniels is not going to change the minds of the Jackson "powers that be".

For fifty or more years, they have absolutely HATED the fact that their children live so close to Massillon and GOD FORBID might interact with Massillon kids.

I don't see this attitude changing for the foreseeable future.

Does the Fed vote have to be unanimous? If it does, this whole discussion is moot because the Jackson people will not vote for anything that might cause their precious innocent little angels to have to venture into Massillon to a football game.

And---I'm sorry Monte, but the whole Jesse Davis thing is not going to help.


Your are exactly right and I couldn't have said it any better. If the Jackson vote is required, it ain't happening and there ain't a damn thing McDaniels can do about it.
McDaniels will soon find out what it's like to coach at Jackson and he ain't gonna like it.

[Fats]

Has McKinley ever bragged about winning a FED title ??? You can wipe your butt with those. I'd rather play an Iggy, Ed's, Harding, Moeller, Elder, etc vs those FED schools.

Amen Brother!!!!!

[Fats]

I will post this again and again, until someone from the administration backs up their statements with facts.
Joining the Fed will NOT increase our revenue.
Joining the Fed will not help our National Reputation.
Joining the FEd will not help our TIGER PROGRAM.

If the administration wants to join the FEd then lets have a six year study.

Schedule FED teams the first 3 weeks of the season for the next six years with a Home and Away schedule. See if attendance is good.If our revenue increases. If FAn interest remains after the 6 years.
Lets not just make statements without valid facts.

[Fats]

People, not every league is going to have team after team full of state powers. If the Fed has Massillon, McK, Perry, Jackson, etc. that comes pretty close. People on here want to continue to play a suicidal independent schedule on the basis that those teams would make us better - the Fed is no slouch. It's not like we're playing Sandy Valley, Tuslaw, etc.

If you think Perry and Jackson and N. Canton, GlenOak are state powers, I wonder about your football knowledge.
Fed lovers should make up their minds, first we need to join the Fed so we do not play the weak teams like D. C. and Canada. But, then they say we need to join the FED to stop playing a (your words)" suicidal independent schedule").

[Fats]

I don't think "the chiefs" are putting the wishes of the football season ticket holders at the top of their list, as well they shouldn't. "[Quote]
[Qoute]If some of the teams or kids in the minor sports could win a league championship, or be voted a league MVP, then I certainly can miss an away game now and then.

I disagree with the Not putting season ticket holders at the top of their list.
Sure all areas should be considered. But, Massillon is a different program then all of the rest. We have 4000+ season ticket holders and they should have a say in what goes on in this program.

As for getting voted a league MVP, Forget it. The FED teams will stick to their own. They have proven that is the past.

If you would rather go see our Tigers beat up another N. Canton team instead of Massillon playing a powerhouse then I suggest that you buy season tickets for a FED team, I myself want to see the BEST high school game I can see.

[massillon catholic]

I will post this again and again, until someone from the administration backs up their statements with facts.
Joining the Fed will NOT increase our revenue.
Joining the Fed will not help our National Reputation.
Joining the FEd will not help our TIGER PROGRAM.

If the administration wants to join the FEd then lets have a six year study.

Schedule FED teams the first 3 weeks of the season for the next six years with a Home and Away schedule. See if attendance is good.If our revenue increases. If FAn interest remains after the 6 years.
Lets not just make statements without valid facts.



Well said!

[MassFan3]

If you think Perry and Jackson and N. Canton, GlenOak are state powers, I wonder about your football knowledge.
Fed lovers should make up their minds, first we need to join the Fed so we do not play the weak teams like D. C. and Canada. But, then they say we need to join the FED to stop playing a (your words)" suicidal independent schedule").


I didn't include Hoover and Glenoak, but thanks for reading my post.:zzz:

We play teams from DC and Canada because nobody will play us and that is why we have trouble scheduling. Just because we never have an open date on our schedule doesn't mean that scheduling is a non-issue. That just means we have had our A.D. working his butt of to make sure we have a game - no matter who we play. I could care less about playing a team from Canada or DC. We'd get more attendance out of the Fed games - believe it. Did you go to the North Park game last year? They brought what, 1 or 2 parents total, and our fans didn't care either.

And yes, playing Iggy, Harding, Elder, Mentor, Solon, etc. year in and year out is suicidal. Show me a post where I said we need to play weaker teams. My saying that I don't think we should play a meatgrinder is not the same thing as "we need to play weaker teams".

[MassFan3]

I will post this again and again, until someone from the administration backs up their statements with facts.
Joining the Fed will NOT increase our revenue.
Joining the Fed will not help our National Reputation.
Joining the FEd will not help our TIGER PROGRAM.

If the administration wants to join the FEd then lets have a six year study.

Schedule FED teams the first 3 weeks of the season for the next six years with a Home and Away schedule. See if attendance is good.If our revenue increases. If FAn interest remains after the 6 years.
Lets not just make statements without valid facts.


In 5-10 years when our school is the size of Lake and/or smaller...and we're playing Iggy, Elder, Mentor, etc. and continue to lose, THAT will not help our national reputation. And as for our Tiger Program, we'd actually have a much better one if we were in a league.

[MassFan3]

[QUOTE=giant lugey;58223]I don't think "the chiefs" are putting the wishes of the football season ticket holders at the top of their list, as well they shouldn't. "

I disagree with the not putting season ticket holders at the top of their list.
Sure all areas should be considered. But, Massillon is a different program then all of the rest. We have 4000+ season ticket holders and they should have a say in what goes on in this program.






So let's just have the fans run the program, then. That makes a whole lot of sense. There are so many walls to jump in this program in order to get anything done, and you are suggesting we add another wall. Just because you buy season tickets doesn't mean you can have a say in what goes on. It's not your job. If you don't like what goes on, then don't buy a season ticket.

[MassFan3]

One more thing while I ramble on....

This isn't college football. You can compare it to college football all day long until you're blue in the face, (and some aspects of the program are like a college program) but at the end of the day, these are high school kids. You as a ticket holder want to see the best game possible, but I'd just like to see all the games with all the players in them. A high school kid cannot go through what our kids go through and not get hurt. Look how many injuries we have had. Star players and role players alike get hurt.

Monte will even back this statement up. How sore were you and how beaten up was your body after the schedule you played? How about your little bro in 2005 and 2006 playing such a tough schedule. You guys would have to agree that it takes a toll.


PS: I'm tired of having an independent affiliation and playing DIII and DIV teams. Now THAT'S embarrassing. Also, how many times have we lost to Benedictine, now a DIV team?? (They were DIII) You call THAT good for the program? Buchtel, Ursuline, Dover....that's what you get when you're not in a league. CRAP.

[section3]

the fed schedule guarantees one thing, 3 or 4 away league games every year. now add 1 decent game week 1-3 and we are on the road 4 games a year MINIMUM. n.c. brought no one here in the playoff game, and how many tickets were we given for the perry game?? the arguement is fed teams coming here bring more fans than the d.c. teams. yes thats true, but we are playing 7 or 8 home games. i do not see the dollars evening out going down to 5 or 6 home games. i know the band has no say in this but they will lose plenty of money from concessions and 50/50. also look back at past federal league schedules and see how many d.c. and canadian teams they have been scheduling week 1 - 3. the fed would be better off mixing in off weeks throughout the season instead of 1-3.

[dirtybear]

I vote No but who am I to say:
#1 the Fed is not strong every year.
#2 It will be hard to compete year in, in all sports (McK NC maybe 3 times in Hoops)
#3 Massillon has more to lose then to gain in football, can you handle a fluke lost to Lake. it could happen.

I got a League that would be Great:

Massillon Clev. Benny
Iggy Glenville
St. Eds McK
Warren Walsh
Mooney Central Cath
If you going to lose then you should lose to the best every year.

[tiger#22]

In 5-10 years when our school is the size of Lake and/or smaller...and we're playing Iggy, Elder, Mentor, etc. and continue to lose, THAT will not help our national reputation. And as for our Tiger Program, we'd actually have a much better one if we were in a league.

Facts to back any of that up?

[tiger#22]

[QUOTE=Fats;58288]




So let's just have the fans run the program, then. That makes a whole lot of sense. There are so many walls to jump in this program in order to get anything done, and you are suggesting we add another wall. Just because you buy season tickets doesn't mean you can have a say in what goes on. It's not your job. If you don't like what goes on, then don't buy a season ticket.

I dont agree with having the fans run the program of course but you do have to remember if people arent buying season tickets there wouldnt be a program, along with about 20 other activities at the school.

[tiger#22]

PS: I'm tired of having an independent affiliation and playing DIII and DIV teams. Now THAT'S embarrassing. Also, how many times have we lost to Benedictine, now a DIV team?? (They were DIII) You call THAT good for the program? Buchtel, Ursuline, Dover....that's what you get when you're not in a league. CRAP.

I bet you werent saying that in Dec of 05' at Fawcett Stadium though.

[Obie Wan]

I will post this again and again, until someone from the administration backs up their statements with facts.
Joining the Fed will NOT increase our revenue.
Joining the Fed will not help our National Reputation.
Joining the FEd will not help our TIGER PROGRAM.
Let's see your facts to prove that it won't.

[tiger#22]

Let's see your facts to prove that it won't.

I am still waiting on facts to prove that it would. Actually still waiting on facts from the "admin", in reality all they have ever said it would help is the scheduling issue, which has never been an issue.

[longtimefirsttime]

Also, how many times have we lost to Benedictine, now a DIV team?? (They were DIII) You call THAT good for the program?

Just a minor clarification. The Tigers are 22-4-1 against Benedictine. One of the best programs in their history was matched up with what most would agree was the lowest period in Tiger football history in over 60 years. When their pool of All-Ohio and Mr. Football players moved on, so did their desire to play the Tigers. That's nothing new.

[longtimefirsttime]

Will Lake be leaving the Fed anytime soon?
I don't know where they'd go. The NBC might be a good fit, but unless they went to a tiered format, there would be too many teams (unless someone would leave). Suburban? Too many teams right now. Pioneer? Not a good geographical fit. Western Reserve? Doubtful. They'd likely dominate the Portage Trail and PAC-7.

[longtimefirsttime]

Does the Fed vote have to be unanimous? If it does, this whole discussion is moot because the Jackson people will not vote for anything that might cause their precious innocent little angels to have to venture into Massillon to a football game.


I believe ObieWan once posted it would take 75% or greater of league members voting yes.

[austinsm11]

I believe ObieWan once posted it would take 75% or greater of league members voting yes.

If that is true, then I don't see it happening. Possibly if it was a majority vote. If Fitch and Boardman leave then all but one team would have to vote yes.

[Fats]

[QUOTE=MassFan3;58292]

I dont agree with having the fans run the program of course but you do have to remember if people arent buying season tickets there wouldnt be a program, along with about 20 other activities at the school.
Just for the record not my quote. In an earlier post if looked like this quote was contributed to Fats.
But I do agree that the Season Ticket holders are an important part of this program, along with the booster club. So no they should not run the program but their thoughts and opinions should have some weight.

[Fats]

Let's see your facts to prove that it won't.

First, If we go with my suggestion and have a 6 yr Home/Away schedule with the FEds then maybe we can see some facts.
Second - Tell me how LESS Home games which means 1. Loss of Ticket Revenue. 2. Loss of concessions 3. Loss of 50/50 funds
Increases our revenue. Also, Fed lovers may not want to admit this but Massillon will Win the majority of games against the FED. Just look at our past records. Believe it or not but eventually fan interest in these games will fade and the casual fans will stop buying tickets.
Also, We will not play powerhouses the first 3 weeks of the season. How many teams will want to schedule Massillon early in the season, or How many state rank teams will Massillon want to play early in the season. Their is a reason why you play a certain caliber of teams early. Just look to the east and to the Fed teams and see how many powers they play in the first 3 weeks. Heck, they Do Not even want to schedule us.
Third - If you think playing the likes of GlenOak, Jackson and Perry will bring us National recognition, I have to totally disagree.
So over the years by playing in the FED we slowly become just a memory on the National scene. Playing State and Out of State teams puts us in the national mindset in high school football.
So Facts or not , the administration has never answered any of these questions. Say No to The FED.

[Fats]

One more thing while I ramble on....

This isn't college football. You can compare it to college football all day long until you're blue in the face, (and some aspects of the program are like a college program) but at the end of the day, these are high school kids. You as a ticket holder want to see the best game possible, but I'd just like to see all the games with all the players in them. A high school kid cannot go through what our kids go through and not get hurt. Look how many injuries we have had. Star players and role players alike get hurt.

Monte will even back this statement up. How sore were you and how beaten up was your body after the schedule you played? How about your little bro in 2005 and 2006 playing such a tough schedule. You guys would have to agree that it takes a toll.

PS: I'm tired of having an independent affiliation and playing DIII and DIV teams. Now THAT'S embarrassing. Also, how many times have we lost to Benedictine, now a DIV team?? (They were DIII) You call THAT good for the program? Buchtel, Ursuline, Dover....that's what you get when you're not in a league. CRAP.

I guess that is what makes me different from a Fed lover, I think Our Tiger Program is special and different from any high school program in the country. Massillon players know what they are getting into when they put on the Orange and Black and I think the majority wants to play a tough schedule. You first say our schedule is so tough our kids can not take the punishment but then you state "I'm tired of having an independent affiliation and playing DIII and DIV teams. Now THAT'S embarrassing. Also, how many times have we lost to Benedictine, now a DIV team?? (They were DIII) You call THAT good for the program? Buchtel, Ursuline, Dover....that's what you get when you're not in a league. "

So if you think are program is at the level of the FED then I guess you are right we should join the FED in football, personally I think we are a top notch program and we do not need to join the FED.

[MTown]

If I could address the issue of allowing our other sports to compete for a league title, and I speak only for myself on this issue...

When I was in high school I played tennis. We played just about every Fed team. The thought of playing for a Fed trophy, or league trophy of any kind, never even crossed my mind. You just play to beat their asses...even in tennis. So to me, the idea that one of the reasons that our kids should be in a league is to compete for a league trophy is insignificant. I doubt our kids would care...they just want to win for bragging rights.

[MTown]

And one more thing....those Benedictine and Dayton Chaminade teams would have beaten every team in the Fed. That's a bad arguement.

[Fats]

I didn't include Hoover and Glenoak, but thanks for reading my post.:zzz:

We play teams from DC and Canada because nobody will play us and that is why we have trouble scheduling. Just because we never have an open date on our schedule doesn't mean that scheduling is a non-issue. That just means we have had our A.D. working his butt of to make sure we have a game - no matter who we play. I could care less about playing a team from Canada or DC. We'd get more attendance out of the Fed games - believe it. Did you go to the North Park game last year? They brought what, 1 or 2 parents total, and our fans didn't care either.

And yes, playing Iggy, Harding, Elder, Mentor, Solon, etc. year in and year out is suicidal. Show me a post where I said we need to play weaker teams. My saying that I don't think we should play a meatgrinder is not the same thing as "we need to play weaker teams".

Okay this is your words. "If the Fed has Massillon, McK, Perry, Jackson, etc. " So I say again if you think Perry, Jackson and whoever etc. is. Then I question your understanding of who a State Power is. Can you honestly say Perry or Jackson are state powers or top notch teams. And who do you mean by etc.

[monte81]

And one more thing....those Benedictine and Dayton Chaminade teams would have beaten every team in the Fed. That's a bad arguement.

Agree! People get a bad impression that DII and DIII programs are sorry but that is far from the truth. Beny won the championship in 2002 or 2003 killing everybody they played and had more DI recruits than all NEO except Glenville.

A. Butchell would be top 20 in DI and would go undefeated if they wouldn't except challanges unlike some FED teams!

[austinsm11]

A. Butchell would be top 20 in DI and would go undefeated if they wouldn't except challanges unlike some FED teams!

I would say that is stretching it a bit.

[monte81]

I would say that is stretching it a bit.

They only lose to the top DI programs every year. Stretching it I am not by a long shot.

[massillon catholic]

They only lose to the top DI programs every year. Stretching it I am not by a long shot.


Monte: I agree with much that you say, but you are way off on this one. Div III Steubenville buried them twice last year. Butchel is an average team, at best. They do have some talented players, but to say they will go undefeated is way out of line.

[austinsm11]

They only lose to the top DI programs every year. Stretching it I am not by a long shot.

Hey, they schedule tough teams. I will give them that. But they are not a top 20 DI team. Be honest with yourself. And their only losses are not to top DI teams every year. I also do not see how losing to the top DI teams qualifies a team to be in the top 20 in DI.

They have lost to Stuebenville, Fitch, Warren Harding, Walsh Jesuit, Glenville, Hoban in recent years. These are all good teams, but far from the top DI programs you are claiming.

I also do not see how losing to the top DI teams qualifies a team to be in the top 20 in DI. Playing crap teams in your league and then losing to the decent teams you play makes you a top 20 DI team? If the played a DI schedule from top to bottom year in and year out the would have quite a few more losses.

[Paul Brown]

The FED has an honest-to-goodness, unadulterated disdain for Massillon.

.


and Massillon fans have for the FED. Which is why it is blinding everyone judgment. There's a reason everyone outside of Stark County thinks Massillon would be a good fit for the Federal League. It's because they have no emotional ties and can think unbiased.

[monte81]

Austinism11 and MC ---- Big Red would of beat 50% of our top DI teams including Perry and the rest of the FED except maybe McKinley. WGH and Glenville are definitely top tier teams making the playoffs every year this decade for the most part. SO to me A. Butchell is a legit and viable program. They win the city series every year and compete against top tier teams also winning a few of those games or playing real close!

They would qualify for the DI playoffs if they were in the FED!!!

[austinsm11]

Austinism11 and MC ---- Big Red would of beat 50% of our top DI teams including Perry and the rest of the FED except maybe McKinley. WGH and Glenville are definitely top 20 teams in Ohio and they lost to us. SO to me A. Butchell is a legit and viable program. They win the city series every year and compete against top tier teams also winning a few of those games are playing real close!

I don't think I would be bragging about winning the ACS. Butchel goes undefeated in league play, schedules some tougher non-league teams, and usually loses. How does this equal a top 20 DI program?

Are you implying that Perry and the rest of the Fed are top DI teams? Perry might sneek in towards the bottom, but the rest?

[austinsm11]

Austinism11 and MC ---- Big Red would of beat 50% of our top DI teams including Perry

Massillon, McKinley, Harding, Iggy, St. Eds, St. X, Mentor, Moeller, Colerain, Elder, Freemont Ross, Brunswick, Hilliard Davidson, UA, Solon, Perry,

Here are 16 decent teams. What 8 teams could Big Red beat on a regular basis?

[DAWGH8R]

Big Red would of beat 50% of our top DI teams including Perry and the rest of the FED except maybe McKinley. !!

Monte,

Unless you've been missing the playoffs and State Title games, you need to up that number to about 90 - 95 %. I don't think any FED teams could have beat the BIG RED last year. Once those 12 teams get to the TITLE GAMES, division doesn't mean a whole lot.

Do you think any FED teams could beat : Col. St. Francis DeSales , Avon Lake , Cardinal Mooney , St. Henry , Dola Hardin Northern , Versailles, or Coldwater,..............to name a few ??????? These are all lower Division teams that would OWN the FED.:gogogo:

[DAWGH8R]

Massillon, McKinley, Harding, Iggy, St. Eds, St. X, Mentor, Moeller, Colerain, Elder, Freemont Ross, Brunswick, Hilliard Davidson, UA, Solon, Perry,

Here are 16 decent teams. What 8 teams could Big Red beat on a regular basis?


Regular basis ????? Mentor, Fremont Ross, Brunswick, HD, UA , Solon and Perry.

[DAWGH8R]

When Monte says " our top D1 teams ", I think he is refering to "our" as a more local/ county region. If the BIG RED were in Stark County, the FED teams wouldn't play them.

[austinsm11]

DAWGH8R: His original statement was that Butchel would be a top 20 DI program. I assume he meant state, since there aren't 20 DI programs in the county. I just don't think that is even close to being true.

I agree that the teams you mention in the other divisions have talent, but I don't know that they would beat DI teams or FED teams on a regular basis. There will always be those years that they could beat a down DI FED team.

I guess since I haven't watched any of the championship games in several years, I will defer to those of you that have. I know Big Red got by Dover by 3 in the playoffs and I would say all the FED teams are better than Dover.


BTW, if Big Red is so good, why haven't we tried to schedule with them.

[Fats]

DAWGH8R: His original statement was that Butchel would be a top 20 DI program. I assume he meant state, since there aren't 20 DI programs in the county. I just don't think that is even close to being true.

I agree that the teams you mention in the other divisions have talent, but I don't know that they would beat DI teams or FED teams on a regular basis. There will always be those years that they could beat a down DI FED team.

I guess since I haven't watched any of the championship games in several years, I will defer to those of you that have. I know Big Red got by Dover by 3 in the playoffs and I would say all the FED teams are better than Dover.


BTW, if Big Red is so good, why haven't we tried to schedule with
them.

I believe that we did try to schedule them a few years ago and they declined.

[austinsm11]

I believe that we did try to schedule them a few years ago and they declined.

That seems familiar to me as well. I believe they stopped playing us to do a big decline in enrollment. Now that they are winning state championships at DIII you would think that they would want a shot at us again.

[obie7661]

That seems familiar to me as well. I believe they stopped playing us to do a big decline in enrollment. Now that they are winning state championships at DIII you would think that they would want a shot at us again.

Steubenville will be in D IV this year.

[DAWGH8R]

The BIG RED, however attractive and yearned for by fans of both schools, would be a LOSE-LOSE situation for us.

If we win, we were supposed to, if we lose, we get "laughed at" for losing to a D4 school. People that have NO KNOWLEDGE of GOOD FOOTBALL , don't know that enrollment does not measure how good a team is.

Some of you guys need to get out more. Your missing some REALLY good OHIO football out there !!

[austinsm11]

Some of you guys need to get out more. Your missing some REALLY good OHIO football out there !!

I agree but 8 hour trips home from NC are a little much for a weekend game.

It just seems like both schools could get together. We have lost to very good DIII teams before (not sure about DIV). Besides, when have we really cared what other people think about Massillon?

[Fats]

Talking about good lower division schools, I hear that Mooney could be competitive with almost all of the Div. I schools.

[monte81]

DAWGH8R: His original statement was that Butchel would be a top 20 DI program. I assume he meant state, since there aren't 20 DI programs in the county. I just don't think that is even close to being true.

I agree that the teams you mention in the other divisions have talent, but I don't know that they would beat DI teams or FED teams on a regular basis. There will always be those years that they could beat a down DI FED team.

I guess since I haven't watched any of the championship games in several years, I will defer to those of you that have. I know Big Red got by Dover by 3 in the playoffs and I would say all the FED teams are better than Dover.


BTW, if Big Red is so good, why haven't we tried to schedule with them.

Butchell would be a top 20 DI school in Ohio. Year in and year out they would compete and earn a few playoff berths just like the rest. From the elite 10 teams we have in the state it is a drop off after that.

Big REd is a powerhouse and so is Mooney and would destroy a very high percentage of teams in DI every year! DI HS football compared to DIII is not that far off with the elite programs!