Transfers and recruiting

[Tiger paw]

A popular sports website is running a thread on what "public" school had the most transfers this year.

There from Cincinnatti and trying to see what the tigers got this season.

Let them know we will be playing them ON THE ROAD and with home grown boys.I can hear the excuses after week 3 already.

I think last years state runner-up team has some Cincinnatti teams and fans nervous.:lol:

[scottyotc]

Any kid that enrolls and walks those halls is a Tiger....it does tickle me to death that we are sitting where we are right now with Massillon kids only....its tough to whup a Massillon kid...you should see me trying to catch my 3...lol:tig:

[longtimefirsttime]

Some of the posts get my blood pressure up initially. Then I remind myself the Tigers are doing things right if the Cinci posters are talking about them so much.

[Smitty]

(IF this is the certain "snappy" website you're referring to....)

They have their own history of Ohio H.S. football... it starts in 1972... they only recognize Paul Brown for the year the Bengals played the 49ers in the Super Bowl... the greatest coaches are Faust & Mancuso... Massillon is the ONLY school that has "homer" refs, illegally recruits, and has 8th-grade hold-backs...

[Smitty]

Frankly, I'd love for someone else (I have NO credibility on that web site!) to post that Tedd Ginn Sr was just hired as an assistant coach at Massillon,... & he's bringing his best 8-9 players with him.


Do the Moe fans know that one of their former assistant coaches is now on OUR staff??

What state did he recruit from in '82?

[Obie Wan]

Do the Moe fans know that one of their former assistant coaches is now on OUR staff??

What state did he recruit from in '82?
It might be amusing to get a couple of beers into Kaple and listen to some stories. :wink:

[GrowlingTiger87]

It might be amusing to get a couple of beers into Kaple and listen to some stories. :wink:

I actually agree with this statement. Something tells me though he would probably be pretty tight-lipped about it, but who knows.

[monte81]

Why even worry about the recruits. Moeller has recruited longer than I have lived so why stop now! We are going to destroy them at the house of our legandary coach! I will smile all the way home! Our whole team is from massillon and it feels great to see them shine!!!

[Fats]

Any kid that puts on a Massillon uniform is a Massillon Boy. You go to school at Washington High then you are a Tiger.

[monte81]

Any kid that puts on a Massillon uniform is a Massillon Boy. You go to school at Washington High then you are a Tiger.


Not the case always. We have had kids transfer and play at Massillon that do not have the passion, heart, and skill but still played over hometown boys. I remember in a lose to Mckinley in 1987 my junior year that a star player (transfer) sat out 3 quarters claiming a bruised shoulder! Wow--- everybody aint no TIGER!!!!!

[TigerCoach]

It might be amusing to get a couple of beers into Kaple and listen to some stories. :wink:

That's a great idea! I'm going to the Booster Club Staek Fry tomorrow night (with an open bar!:drinkem: ) and I'll see if he'll tell me anything. I played against the Moeller teams in the early 80's, so maybe he'll tell me how they recruited Mark Brooks and the other 10 Division I players that year.

[DAWGH8R]

How'd the steak fry go ??? Any info from Bill ????

[scottyotc]

Any kid that puts on a Massillon uniform is a Massillon Boy. You go to school at Washington High then you are a Tiger.

yeah know I said that 6 posts ago...lol...

[scottyotc]

Jim though I coached at LA and loved the school....I am offended by my status....Im a Poet....if any thing can be done cool if not also cool...your site your rules ....

[scottyotc]

Not the case always. We have had kids transfer and play at Massillon that do not have the passion, heart, and skill but still played over hometown boys. I remember in a lose to Mckinley in 1987 my junior year that a star player (transfer) sat out 3 quarters claiming a bruised shoulder! Wow--- everybody aint no TIGER!!!!!

Monte I respect you you were a good ball player ...your rhetoric is horribly inaccurate....would you like a list of Massillon greats...standard bearers ...that werent born at MCH ...as you and I were...you were ...werent you...

[ChronicTiger]

Monte I respect you you were a good ball player ...your rhetoric is horribly inaccurate....would you like a list of Massillon greats...standard bearers ...that werent born at MCH ...as you and I were...you were ...werent you...

:scratchchin:

[monte81]

Monte I respect you you were a good ball player ...your rhetoric is horribly inaccurate....would you like a list of Massillon greats...standard bearers ...that werent born at MCH ...as you and I were...you were ...werent you...

I am saying that most transfers wont even make a differance in the game results! Who are you going too name-- Speilman, Liggett, Zwick, Wes Sieginthaler!!! Every kid that transfers is not all what is hyped up to be-- period! There has been a few good ones but I would rather take my chances with a few hometown boys! There aint one significant player that on this years team that was not grown up in Massillon!!! It makes a differance in the trenches! I played with a few transfers and McKinley whooped us in 1986 & 1987! When Owens came here we got back to Massillon business in 1988 without all the hyped tranfer so called superstars and we started winning! Hell ya I was born and raised a tiger!!!

[Kamd50]

"Hell ya I was born and raised a tiger!!!"............Love it, Monte, love it lol :tig: :ers:

[MTFootBall59]

born and raised i still got my football when iw as born at MCH so yup yup all home grown here:weightlift:

[ChronicTiger]

born and raised i still got my football when iw as born at MCH so yup yup all home grown here:weightlift:


:gotigers:

[tiger74]

went to bowers but was born in doctors hospital. I am a tiger through and through.:gotigers: :TIG2:

[jstafford]

Monte I respect you you were a good ball player ...your rhetoric is horribly inaccurate....would you like a list of Massillon greats...standard bearers ...that werent born at MCH ...as you and I were...you were ...werent you...
Why dont we start with a list of Massillon born players who were standout players all of their lives in flag football, midget football and at longfellow or LA until they got to the highschool and were forced to sit the bench behind someone with less than half of their athletic ability or forced to limit their exposer by only being allowed to play one side of the ball when they had the talent to be on the field at all times...that's the list i want to see.

[Kamd50]

OUCH! And I must say, that I have to agree:tig: :ers:

[CarlE]

And I must say that I'm reading a big old thread that smells like sour grapes. And I've heard the story before.

[monte81]

I am glad the people are weighing in on the situation! You will see that alot of kids get lost in the shuffle of politics, who your dad is, or because the city is paying the parents wages! my mother works for the school system but was employed before my brother and i played! No handouts here! born and raised a tiger!-- a killer on the field. When #7 signs his deal my mother will be 3 for 3 with the tigers producing athletes not even counting my other family members!!! I can name many players who sat the bench when a transfer moved in- that dont mean he is better!! if we when a championship with a all star team of transfers does that make it a Massillon Championship? I know we want to win but lets keep it Massillon and not go back to the 1980's with the recruits, transfers, and OHSAA probes on the kids! It did not bring us a title then anyway!!!

[Kamd50]

However, you can't really argue with this fact :
"It did not bring us a title then anyway!!!"
I personally don't think that it sounds like sour grapes so much as it does as having pride in our own boys. And I would be willing to bet that most of us know of somebody throughout the years that were denied because of this. My feeling is that NO ONE should recruit and that all schools should play with their own homeboys. But that's probably a dying sentiment these days. And yes, I realize that it is never going to be that way, just my view of how it should be.

[jstafford]

And I must say that I'm reading a big old thread that smells like sour grapes. And I've heard the story before.
It's not a case of sour grapes with me because i did my thing evertime i stepped on the field. I am giving an observation of the things that i witnessed as a player and a fan and that are still going on today. If you want to win championships you must put your best players on the field at all times. How can you have a freshman that for lack of a better word is a beast on offense and defense and when he gets to highschool he is forced to make a choice between the two.

[monte81]

And I must say that I'm reading a big old thread that smells like sour grapes. And I've heard the story before.

Sour grapes? My brother(Travis) and I are two year varsity starters and both received DI schalrships at Massillon and our little brother (Darion) is a captain on this years team! jstafford is Jason Stafford-- class of 1989 --ranked #11 on the single season rushing list and went to YSU(2 national championship rings)! We are just stating that transfers/recruits hurts the game, the tigers, and most of all the kids that grow up in Massillon to get pushed to the side when a transfer comes in because a booster claims he can get us to the ship! Be real--stay real and play with the real hometown kids that will die before they quit, lay down, or just flat out there for the publicity that playing for the tigers may bring to a career!!!

[CarlE]

Congrats to all you guys. Your accomplishments speak for themselves. Look guys I'm not saying that we should flood our football team with talent from other areas. We all know that wouldn't work. However, to LEGALLY obtain a player at a key, or skilled position every now and then can only help our team. I fully understand the heart and mentality of guys that have grown up in Massillon. I really do. Heck, I grew up in Massillon. The bottom line is, and is being discussed on another thread is that our measuring stick of success is a state championship. It's been 36 years since we had one, and none since the play-off system started. For us to compete year in and year out with the schools that DO do this, we are going to have to enhance our team from the outside. The numbers just won't work for as small of a DI as we are. There is no way around that.

By the way, it was great watching all you guys play. Good luck in life!!

[TigerCoach]

My senior year, 1981 football season, I believe that a transfer cost us a chance to make the playoffs. Greg Grimsley transferred from Perry, and Mike Currence thought he was the next Bill Harmon or something. Bottom line, he was slow, fat and didn't do much except keep another better player on the sidelines (Michael Moore). We lost to Moeller 24-14, to McK 9-6, mainly because we couldn't score or move the ball. We also lost to Barberton 25-22 when they ran a double reverse on a kick-off return late in the game.

Granted, we also had guys who transferred who helped us that year, namely Rick & Chris Spielman, but in my opinion, transfers do nothing but cause desention within the team. I feel a team is much stronger, although maybe not as talented individually, when the team grows up together.

[monte81]

Congrats to all you guys. Your accomplishments speak for themselves. Look guys I'm not saying that we should flood our football team with talent from other areas. We all know that wouldn't work. However, to LEGALLY obtain a player at a key, or skilled position every now and then can only help our team. I fully understand the heart and mentality of guys that have grown up in Massillon. I really do. Heck, I grew up in Massillon. The bottom line is, and is being discussed on another thread is that our measuring stick of success is a state championship. It's been 36 years since we had one, and none since the play-off system started. For us to compete year in and year out with the schools that DO do this, we are going to have to enhance our team from the outside. The numbers just won't work for as small of a DI as we are. There is no way around that.

By the way, it was great watching all you guys play. Good luck in life!!

Thank you and we appreciate the applause! i still disagree that we need outside help!!! We had numerous chances to win it and we blew it! Fumbles, coaching mistakes,etc,... we had it several times but blew it! We have the talent in MASSILLON WITH A 350 BOY ENROLLMENT! PLAY THE BEST ALL THE TIME AND THE SHIP WILL FOLLOW!!!!!!!

[Red50Go]

Transfers can hurt you or they can help you. Depends on the coach. Would Zwick have been a better QB had he grown up here? I dont doubt it. But you dont want to eliminate open enrollment, trust me. Especially if you are hell bent on opting up.

[TigerCoach]

I agree, Red50go, you need to keep the doors open if you want to compete. I'm just giving a good example that when someone transfers in, it has effects both ways.

[monte81]

I agree, Red50go, you need to keep the doors open if you want to compete. I'm just giving a good example that when someone transfers in, it has effects both ways.

Thank you coach! You keep open enrollment but please do not count on the whole if we get so and so we can win it! the 1980's showed us how recruits and transfers do not make a massillon team-- I will say again Speilmans, johnsons, Zwick, Jordan are exceptions!!! EXCEPTIONS! THE MANIONS, MCGUIRES, MILLERS, RELFORDS, STAFFORDS, LAMBERTS,ETC,... Icould keep on going but we make the tiger tradition! We lost 20-10 from 1985-87 with an all star team of recruits that went to college off the Massillon mystic and gave back nothing! At least chris, rick, craig, and pete johnson claim Massillon home!!!!!!!

[jeroe]

I am saying that most transfers wont even make a differance in the game results! Who are you going too name-- Speilman, Liggett, Zwick, Wes Sieginthaler!!! Every kid that transfers is not all what is hyped up to be-- period! There has been a few good ones but I would rather take my chances with a few hometown boys! There aint one significant player that on this years team that was not grown up in Massillon!!! It makes a differance in the trenches! I played with a few transfers and McKinley whooped us in 1986 & 1987! When Owens came here we got back to Massillon business in 1988 without all the hyped tranfer so called superstars and we started winning! Hell ya I was born and raised a tiger!!!

Transfers playing when they shouldn’t was one problem in 85-87, but it wasn't the only problem.

Inability to understand talent as a whole was a problem.

Starting a Big 10 middle linebacker at QB when there was an all MAC QB sitting on the bench, both home grown was a big problem.

Taking a team that graduated in 88 and was primed for the run and shoot, hadn't lost a game until high school, and running 3 yards and a cloud of dust on offense was another problem.

Lack defensive adjustments was a problem.

Jerome Myrics not toting the rock until he was a senior was a problem!

Wrong players on the line, at QB, ahh never mind!!!!!!!

:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:

[jeroe]

I couldn't bash my head enough in the last post

:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:

[Fats]

My senior year, 1981 football season, I believe that a transfer cost us a chance to make the playoffs. Greg Grimsley transferred from Perry, and Mike Currence thought he was the next Bill Harmon or something. Bottom line, he was slow, fat and didn't do much except keep another better player on the sidelines (Michael Moore). We lost to Moeller 24-14, to McK 9-6, mainly because we couldn't score or move the ball. We also lost to Barberton 25-22 when they ran a double reverse on a kick-off return late in the game.

Granted, we also had guys who transferred who helped us that year, namely Rick & Chris Spielman, but in my opinion, transfers do nothing but cause desention within the team. I feel a team is much stronger, although maybe not as talented individually, when the team grows up together.
I would not blame the transfer I would blame the coach. He is the one who should know his talent. The best kid should play no matter if he is a lifelong resident of Massillon or has moved in. When Zwick was our QB I do not believe their was a better QB on the sidelines. Growing up in Massillon does not give you a automatic start, it should be earned. I will agree that in some years, a kid played (transfer/born and raised) because of some outside influence most ex-tigers can tell you that but lets first earn the right to start and if you wear the Orange and Black then you have every right to earn that starting position.

[monte81]

Transfers playing when they shouldn’t was one problem in 85-87, but it wasn't the only problem.

Inability to understand talent as a whole was a problem.

Starting a Big 10 middle linebacker at QB when there was an all MAC QB sitting on the bench, both home grown was a big problem.

Taking a team that graduated in 88 and was primed for the run and shoot, hadn't lost a game until high school, and running 3 yards and a cloud of dust on offense was another problem.

Lack defensive adjustments was a problem.

Jerome Myrics not toting the rock until he was a senior was a problem!


Wrong players on the line, at QB, ahh never mind!!!!!!!

:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:

You are right-- Jerome Myricks and jason stafford in the backfield with eric at QB would have been sick!!! We had 300 pound linemen and transfers that could not hold down anything up front! But in 1988 we were suspended when we were home grown from top to bottom! Our "D" was one of the best! 3 DI players on the front line(me, Dunnwiddie, & Liggett) and everyone was giving 100% Massillon swagger! 85-87 we had talent but coach had us in the wrong spots! I hated my junior year-- I was starting but the team did not jell-- underclassmen felt that some seniors did not give there all in games!!!!!

[Kamd50]

Monte81, I love your honesty and enjoy your posts:thanx:

[jeroe]

You are right-- Jerome Myricks and jason stafford in the backfield with eric at QB would have been sick!!! We had 300 pound linemen and transfers that could not hold down anything up front! But in 1988 we were suspended when we were home grown from top to bottom! Our "D" was one of the best! 3 DI players on the front line(me, Dunnwiddie, & Liggett) and everyone was giving 100% Massillon swagger! 85-87 we had talent but coach had us in the wrong spots! I hated my junior year-- I was starting but the team did not jell-- underclassmen felt that some seniors did not give there all in games!!!!!


Imagine Norris and Myricks with White at QB the year before. The classes of 87, 88, and 89 combined had plenty of talent. I agree with you about the seniors in 87. That class got the worst of the debacle. 3 years of transplants, suspension hearings, and poor coaching at the top. I know seniors in the class that swore to not allow their kids to attend Massillon because of the way things were handled. Sad but true!

I remember sitting in the lunch room after the 87 season and Ownes walking through and many of the home grown seniors of 88 being pissed that they got the deck of cards they did! Guys that had started from midget through freshman year and were football players but weren't 6-3 300lbs. You know what I am talking about!

I am glad those days are gone its just unfortunate that what could have been just didn't happen in those years.

[LakeCountyTiger]

Monte rocks..